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Not a humanist forum at all…


Forums Forums CFI Forums Feedback Not a humanist forum at all…

This topic contains 16 replies, has 7 voices, and was last updated by  LoisL 9 months ago.

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 16 total)
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  • #19033

    DougC
    Blocked

    … with posters like titanomachina who thinks all humans should be murdered and isn’t shy about posting on it…
    Vyazma who when I arrived here claimed to be an atheist, humanist socialist and now has an orgasm every time that Trump’s name is mentioned. He’s the forum pervert who jumps out from behind the bushes now in his shit stained overcoat and nothing else to flash us then disappear again.
    Mike Yohe who’s a total climate change denier against all the evidence… no stable climate – no humans…
    And no moderating AT ALL to limit their destructive influence on meaningful humanist focused discussion here.
    Sadly CFI forums is just one more cynical bait-and-switch scam in a world full of them…

    #228923

    dougsmith
    Keymaster

    This is a forum for free inquiry. One of the hallmarks of humanism and skepticism is free inquiry. So long as discussion remains relatively civil and therefore within the rules, it is within bounds. Mods and admin do not adjudicate rightness; our position is only to adjudicate rule-following. We try to do so with a light hand.
    As a personal matter, a certain percentage of material here I find absurd, annoying, or even offensive. FWIW.

    #228934

    LoisL
    Participant

    This is a forum for free inquiry. One of the hallmarks of humanism and skepticism is free inquiry. So long as discussion remains relatively civil and therefore within the rules, it is within bounds. Mods and admin do not adjudicate rightness; our position is only to adjudicate rule-following. We try to do so with a light hand.
    As a personal matter, a certain percentage of material here I find absurd, annoying, or even offensive. FWIW.

    You won”t find a discussion grouo worth being a member of that isn’t absurd, annoying or offensive. It comes with the territory.
    Lois

    #229315

    DougC
    Blocked

    This is a forum for free inquiry. One of the hallmarks of humanism and skepticism is free inquiry. So long as discussion remains relatively civil and therefore within the rules, it is within bounds. Mods and admin do not adjudicate rightness; our position is only to adjudicate rule-following. We try to do so with a light hand.
    As a personal matter, a certain percentage of material here I find absurd, annoying, or even offensive. FWIW.

    It’s supposedly based on these values.

    The mission of the Center for Inquiry is to foster a secular society based on science, reason, freedom of inquiry, and humanist values.

    You’ve got people here openly advocating murdering everyone on the planet and others like climate change deniers who are doing their best to see that climate change mitigation never happens which will eventually mean no more humans…and likely little else on Earth.
    https://skepticalscience.com/Lee-commentary-on-Burgess-et-al-PNAS-Permian-Dating.html

    The Permian Mass Extinction 251.9 million years ago, otherwise known as “The Great Dying,” was the closest this planet has come to extinguishing all complex life on Earth. Around 90% of all species died out in this single event, a worse toll even than the Cretaceous extinction that wiped out the dinosaurs.

    Burgess et al’s paper brings the Permian into line with many other global-warming extinction events, like the Triassic, the Toarcian, the Cretaceous Ocean Anoxic Events, The PETM, and the Columbia River Basalts, whose time frames have been progressively reduced as more sophisticated dating has been applied to them. They all produced the same symptoms as today’s climate change – rapid global warming, ocean acidification, and sea level rises, together with oxygen-less ocean dead zones and extinctions. They were all (possibly excluding the PETM – see below) triggered by rare volcanic outpourings called “Large Igneous Provinces,” (LIPs) that emitted massive volumes of CO2 and methane at rates comparable to today’s emissions. The PETM may also have been triggered by a LIP, although that is still debated.
    Can we seriously expect Earth’s climate to behave differently today than it did at all those times in the past?

    Your threshold on what qualifies as rational inquiry based on science and reason is what’s absurd here.

    #229348

    DougC
    Blocked

    This wasn’t someone making an inquiry based on reason and science;
    http://www.centerforinquiry.net/forums/viewthread/18689/

    The recurring proposal of culling a great amount of the human population for the survival of the planet and our species, or even wiping ourselves out to save it. In short I would like to know, why not?

    I haven’t heard of this before, it’s obviously something very important to the poster given the length of how they defended this.
    And it’s not based on their level of reason, they basically stated they are in a fact a psychopath and human life is worthless to them.

    You fear psychopaths because they show just how frail our established systems really are (like morality).

    The proper term is culling. Genocide is the illogical emotional term people use out of fear.

    That whole thread was a psychopath demanding that we come up with some reason why we shouldn’t be exterminated by them, that’s advocating a new Holocaust, not inquiring about anything to do with reason or science in the context of humanist values. It’s the complete denial of them in point of fact.
    Then we get to posters like Mike Yohe who endlessly “ask” questions involving the extremely well established science on global warming then inevitably “prove” it’s not happening. On an issue that scientific research is clearly indicating is heading towards another global scale extinction event if not mitigated. There’s no science, reason or humanity involved in that either, it’s just another way to kill off billions of humans and most other life on the planet.
    Inquiry shorn of humanity in the interests of psychopaths is the opposite of what this forum claims to be…

    #229350

    DougC
    Blocked

    The sad thing is that instead of discussing the implementation of modern technology and wisdom in the creation of truly humanist and sustainable societies, we end up having to defend our right to exist in the face of the emotionally insane. We shouldn’t have to point out to psychopaths why genocide is unacceptable in human terms or to the forum admin that this kind of discussion has no place in a forum committed to reason, science and humanist values.
    For instance instead of discussing the possibilities revealed in something like Nash equilibrium equations on resolving human conflict and creating truly co-operative societies, or how there is a plethora of viable alternatives to fossil fuels that won’t kill us in the near future as the Earth departs from a livable climate, we end up diverted down endless rabbit holes created for the pleasure and gratification of those who clearly lack any ability at all to feel empathy and any real connection to their fellow humans let alone this amazing biosphere that we are part.
    True inquiry isn’t based on how clever you are in manipulating discussion in a highly destructive fashion, it’s a balanced approach to examining the universe we are an intrinsic part of.
    People like climate change deniers or psychopaths who have no concept of any value of life except for their own can only wreck meaningful discussion, not take part in it.

    #233240

    Tanny
    Member

    As a retired forum software developer and regular user of forums since they first appeared on the Internuts I have way too many opinions about this, so I thought I’d afflict you with a few…. 🙂

    This is a forum for free inquiry. One of the hallmarks of humanism and skepticism is free inquiry.

    Free inquiry does not require that pretty much anyone be allowed to say pretty much anything. As example, the rest of your website beyond the forum limits participation to those writers considered to be qualified to address the focus of this site.
    Forum software does not require that pretty much anyone be allowed to say pretty much anything. That publishing model can be applauded for it’s democratic inclusiveness, but it’s also spelled the creeping death of forum culture. “Free inquiry” as typically conceived within forum culture is really a synonym for “low quality”, “declining participation”, “going nowhere” and the typical conclusion of the process is that the forum owner becomes fatally bored with their own forum and pulls the plug.
    Here’s a solution that can be considered by any forum owner who wants to create a forum that isn’t pretty much exactly like every other forum on the net.
    The Magazine Model
    Instead of the water cooler publishing model (almost anybody can say almost anything) consider the magazine model.
    With the magazine model anybody can submit an “article” for publication, but only those writings which reach some standard set by the editors get published. In forum culture this publishing model is seen to be some kind of wacko criminal anti-free speech absurdity 🙂 but it is in fact the way the vast majority of media has been managed for hundreds of years.
    The magazine model is essential if a website wants to attract and engage the best thinkers and writers on the subject of the site. Such quality folks are not going to waste their time endlessly scrolling through petty personality conflict ego battles and the like.
    The water cooler model and magazine model could be combined on a single forum. A magazine model section could be created at the top of the forum as a coveted prestige area. Members are invited to raise their game and submit their best work, and if they succeed in meeting high standards they earn greater prominence and credibility. Lower sections of the forum can keep the water cooler model, which is perhaps gradually phased out over time.
    Or, a probably better solution would be to keep the existing forum as it is, and start a new forum dedicated to quality using the magazine model. This would give a better chance of attracting and keeping the kind of writers who could make such a project a success.
    Forum software is one thing. Publishing models are another. There’s nothing about forum software which requires an admin to use the exact same publishing model as every other forum on the Net. If a site owner wants to stand out from the crowd and rise above the norm, they have to do something different than everybody else. On intellectual type topics, that something else should be a relentless focus on quality thinking and writing.

    #233271

    Tanny
    Member

    What software does this forum use?
    Like it.

    #233278

    Tanny
    Member

    For instance instead of discussing the possibilities revealed in something like Nash equilibrium equations on resolving human conflict and creating truly co-operative societies, or how there is a plethora of viable alternatives to fossil fuels that won’t kill us in the near future as the Earth departs from a livable climate, we end up diverted down endless rabbit holes created for the pleasure and gratification of those who clearly lack any ability at all to feel empathy and any real connection to their fellow humans let alone this amazing biosphere that we are part.

    Ignoring such threads and posters is a good start. My concern is with a different problem that isn’t as easy to solve.
    You want to discuss intelligent topics with intelligent people in an articulate reasonably informed manner. What stops such folks from visiting and participating in this forum, in any forum? The low signal to noise ratio. The people you’d most enjoy engaging just won’t bother to scroll through lots of low quality content in order to find the good stuff. As example, do the owners of this website participate on their own forum?
    The problem isn’t just wackos. It could be well intentioned people who agree with us completely, but just don’t know how to articulate their points. It could be very intelligent people who are easily distracted by personality conflicts. Low quality content comes in many forms.
    The biggest problem, probably a fatal problem, is that forums in general have been branded as junk in the minds of the thought leaders who would make the most interesting conversation partners. It may be too late to do anything about that…

    #233285

    dougsmith
    Keymaster

    What software does this forum use?
    Like it.

    ExpressionEngine I believe.

    #233287

    Tanny
    Member

    Thanks! I’ll check it out…

    #235462

    WaylonCash
    Member

    This is a forum for free inquiry. One of the hallmarks of humanism and skepticism is free inquiry. So long as discussion remains relatively civil and therefore within the rules, it is within bounds. Mods and admin do not adjudicate rightness; our position is only to adjudicate rule-following. We try to do so with a light hand.
    As a personal matter, a certain percentage of material here I find absurd, annoying, or even offensive. FWIW.

    Sir, this is why they think we lack morals.

    #235525

    Advocatus
    Participant

    The Magazine Model
    Instead of the water cooler publishing model (almost anybody can say almost anything) consider the magazine model.
    With the magazine model anybody can submit an “article” for publication, but only those writings which reach some standard set by the editors get published. In forum culture this publishing model is seen to be some kind of wacko criminal anti-free speech absurdity 🙂 but it is in fact the way the vast majority of media has been managed for hundreds of years.

    It sounds like you’re talking about a blog, not a forum. As you mentioned, the rest of the website beyond the forum IS set up as blogs written by various contributors. People are able to respond and ask questions about those articles, and often get feedback from the authors. But some of those articles don’t allow replies. In those case, the reader has no way to comment or ask questions. But that’s not a “forum”. A forum is a marketplace where people can talk freely about a topic. Yes, you get people who don’t agree with you, people who don’t even understand what you said but feel the need to respond anyway — but you also get intelligent conversations sometimes. Which do you want — a forum where people can freely discuss the topic, or do you just want your own personal blog?

    #235533

    LoisL
    Participant

    This is a forum for free inquiry. One of the hallmarks of humanism and skepticism is free inquiry. So long as discussion remains relatively civil and therefore within the rules, it is within bounds. Mods and admin do not adjudicate rightness; our position is only to adjudicate rule-following. We try to do so with a light hand.
    As a personal matter, a certain percentage of material here I find absurd, annoying, or even offensive. FWIW.

    It’s supposedly based on these values.

    The mission of the Center for Inquiry is to foster a secular society based on science, reason, freedom of inquiry, and humanist values.

    You’ve got people here openly advocating murdering everyone on the planet and others like climate change deniers who are doing their best to see that climate change mitigation never happens which will eventually mean no more humans…and likely little else on Earth.
    https://skepticalscience.com/Lee-commentary-on-Burgess-et-al-PNAS-Permian-Dating.html

    The Permian Mass Extinction 251.9 million years ago, otherwise known as “The Great Dying,” was the closest this planet has come to extinguishing all complex life on Earth. Around 90% of all species died out in this single event, a worse toll even than the Cretaceous extinction that wiped out the dinosaurs.

    Burgess et al’s paper brings the Permian into line with many other global-warming extinction events, like the Triassic, the Toarcian, the Cretaceous Ocean Anoxic Events, The PETM, and the Columbia River Basalts, whose time frames have been progressively reduced as more sophisticated dating has been applied to them. They all produced the same symptoms as today’s climate change – rapid global warming, ocean acidification, and sea level rises, together with oxygen-less ocean dead zones and extinctions. They were all (possibly excluding the PETM – see below) triggered by rare volcanic outpourings called “Large Igneous Provinces,” (LIPs) that emitted massive volumes of CO2 and methane at rates comparable to today’s emissions. The PETM may also have been triggered by a LIP, although that is still debated.
    Can we seriously expect Earth’s climate to behave differently today than it did at all those times in the past?

    Your threshold on what qualifies as rational inquiry based on science and reason is what’s absurd here.
    Yet you stay and continue to post. Why is that?
    I have the same question for Tanny and JSmith. You know the definition of insanity: continuing to do the same thing over and over and expecting a different result. Why don’t you find a blog or forum that is equal to your “superior” intellects? I can’t imagine why you have stayed her for more than 20 minutes. As long as you stay here we can only assume you think it’s a good forum or blog.
    Lois
    Spam line. Spam line. Spam line.
    Spam line. Spam line. Spam line.
    Spam line. Spam line. Spam line.

    #235553

    WaylonCash
    Member

    Not very many replies, not very optimistic view in general(imo), lot of confirmation bias(very close to social media), and yeah hate speech aswell. I am going to stick around for awhile because I see potential for productive discussion.
    One other thing, the forum software is pretty bad. Xenforo has a streamlined format that also allows more individuality in your profile and the ability to “like” someone’s post; without veering into the social media type platform.

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