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Does Man need for religion?


Forums Forums Religion and Secularism Does Man need for religion?

This topic contains 115 replies, has 12 voices, and was last updated by  Player 2 months ago.

Viewing 15 posts - 46 through 60 (of 116 total)
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  • #300393

    Player
    Participant

    What about Jesus.?? Loved the idea of slaves. So much so he told them to obey their masters

    #300396

    Patrick D
    Participant

    “What about Jesus.?? Loved the idea of slaves. So much so he told them to obey their masters”

     

    Not at all strange to me. I’m an atheist. Assuming Jesus actually existed, he was a pretty typical rabbi of his time and place.

    New Testament comments about slavery become not only problematic, but downright embarrassing if one insists Jesus was god.

    The Torah has plenty to say in support of slavery.

    Perhaps the most important named slave in the Bible is ” Hagar the Egyptian”. She was ‘the handmaiden’ (slave)  of Abraham.  He “went to her’ (raped her).As a result, she bore a son, Ishmael, who is recognised by Jews, Christian and Muslims as the father of the Arab people.-Abraham’s son Isaac, with Abraham’s wife Sarah, was father of the Jews.

    #300398

    Player
    Participant

    Old testament better than koran on slavery

    #300485

    LoisL
    Participant

    Patrick D.

    Perhaps the most important named slave in the Bible is ” Hagar the Egyptian”. She was ‘the handmaiden’ (slave)  of Abraham.  He “went to her’ (raped her).As a result, she bore a son, Ishmael, who is recognised by Jews, Christian and Muslims as the father of the Arab people.-Abraham’s son Isaac, with Abraham’s wife Sarah, was father of the Jews.

    Abe must have had one hell of a set of genes. 

    #300493

    TimB
    Participant

    I guess that if Hagar could have gotten an abortion based on being raped, we could have a lot fewer problems in the world, today.

    #300503

    LoisL
    Participant

    TimB wrote:
    <p style=”padding-left: 40px;”>I guess that if Hagar could have gotten an abortion based on being raped, we could have a lot fewer problems in the world, today.</p>
    <p style=”padding-left: 40px;”>You said it! </p>
    <p style=”padding-left: 40px;”></p>

    #300573

    thatoneguy
    Participant

     

    Some of the more extreme treatment of women such as the burqa/niqab and female circumcision, are tribal customs and predate Islam by centuries.

    Yes. Female circumcision is more of an African practice; it’s not found in most of the muslim world. And burkas stem from clothing needed as protection against the sand and sun.

    I keep in mind my own observation that without exception, religions reflect the culture which practices them. Like the Jews, the arabs are semitic tribal people , originally nomadic sheep and goat herders. A harsh life, with continuous fighting and blood feuds with other tribes. This has only stopped in the last hundred years or so.

    Excellent point, though I’m not sure it has stopped……..maybe slowed down a little. A big problem we had in Iraq was not being familiar with the different clans and how much they hate each other.  Although it’s not like we could’ve been that familiar with it.

    #300585

    Patrick D
    Participant

    @thatoneguy

    You’re quite right of course. I guess I came over a bit ethnocentric. I forgot the Christian –Muslim hatred in the former Yugoslavia as well as the Shia-Sunni thing In Iraq, and I haven’t even started on the various terrorist groups.

     

    An aside about Iraq; Saddam Hussein was born in the same town as the most famous muslim (in the West) who ever lived;   A Kurd from Tikrit ;  Sallah al Din .

    #300599

    thatoneguy
    Participant

    Well, there must be something in the water in Tikrit.

    Makes you wonder what Hussein thought of Saladin in light of the fact that he slaughtered hundreds of thousands of Kurds.

    Nobody in that region likes Kurds for some reason.

    • This reply was modified 3 months ago by  thatoneguy.
    • This reply was modified 3 months ago by  thatoneguy.
    • This reply was modified 3 months ago by  thatoneguy.
    • This reply was modified 3 months ago by  thatoneguy.
    #300606

    Patrick D
    Participant

    “Nobody in that region likes Kurds for some reason.”

    Don’t know about’ nobody’ ,but Saddam certainly hated them.  Hatreds in that part of the world can span centuries.

    A good example is ‘,mainstream’  Jews’ and the Samaritans. Jesus may have chose them  for his ‘who is my neighbour’ parable  because they were a hated minority. To outsiders, just another sect of Jews. To orthodox Jews, they were heretics, not  strictly jews.

    Today, Samaritans still exist. There seems to be about 3000 of them left, and they mostly live in  Israel.   Jews and Samaritans  apparently still don’t play well together.

     

    #300621

    TimB
    Participant

    I think no one over there, other than the Kurds themselves want the Kurds to have their own homeland.  Maybe because they are afraid of the Kurds who seem, relatively, to be  badasses compared to any other fighting forces over there (even without the benefits of having their own state).

    #300629

    Patrick D
    Participant

    Yeah, I get that Kurds have a reputation for fierceness. I think I’d be pretty cranky too if people were always trying to wipeout me and mine. I’ve never quite grasped the often obsessive desire for ‘a homeland’. Certainly gives people a reason to kill other people. I don’t think I’d  be willing to die for a political ideal. Would still be willing to fight if someone invaded my country. I’d belt ’em with my walking stick, and set  Major, my Jack Russell ,on ’em!

    There’s an interesting Aussie film, based on “Red Dawn”, called “Tomorrow ,When The War Began”. There’s also a  pretty boring series.

    Do you know the name of the Afghan fighters who have been fighting off invaders for centuries? Is it an elite group, or just ‘ordinary’  Afghans?

    #300642

    thatoneguy
    Participant

    Do you know the name of the Afghan fighters who have been fighting off invaders for centuries? Is it an elite group, or just ‘ordinary’  Afghans?

    Pashtuns?

    #300647

    thatoneguy
    Participant

    I think no one over there, other than the Kurds themselves want the Kurds to have their own homeland.  Maybe because they are afraid of the Kurds who seem, relatively, to be  badasses compared to any other fighting forces over there (even without the benefits of having their own state).

    Well the problem is not really that others are preventing Kurds from having a nation state, the Kurds themselves are too disorganized to establish one.

    #300653

    TimB
    Participant

    IDK if the Kurds have had much of a realistic chance to have their own state.  They seem to be organized enuf to survive, surrounded by enemies, and organized enuf to kick butt in military actions.

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